SDK?

For discussion about Trine, firstly released in 2009 for Windows and on PlayStation Network.
Ark
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SDK?

Postby Ark » Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:45 pm

Is there any plans to release an SDK to support adding custom content?

GVBN
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Re: SDK?

Postby GVBN » Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:54 pm

Maybe. I found a few interesting strings in Trine Demo\data\locale\en\launcher.loc

// NEW TYPE LAUNCHER ADDS
...
launcher_mods_level_editor = Mods && Level Editor

// MISC
...
launcher_extended_mods = Use extended mod selector in Launcher

// MODS AND LEVEL EDITOR
launcher_mods_and_editor = Mods && Level Editor
launcher_survivor_modsupport = Trine features good mod support. Click the button to open the Mods & Level Editor menu.

// LAUNCHER MOD DIALOG
launcher_launch_game = Launch game
launcher_activate = Activate
launcher_deactivate = Deactivate
launcher_mod_info = If you have mods installed, use the drop-down menu above and click "Activate" to select a mod.
launcher_no_mod = No Mod selected
launcher_mod_selection = Mod selection

launcher_editor = Level Editor
launcher_editor_info = The Trine Level Editor allows you to create new missions and mods. Please read the Manual for more information.
launcher_editor_manual = Read The Manual
launcher_editor_inenglish = (in English)
launcher_editor_inenglish_only = (in English only)
launcher_editor_launch = Launch Level Editor
launcher_editor_use_or_read = If you want to use the Level Editor, click Launch Editor or Read Editor Help.
launcher_editor_read_help = Read Editor Help
launcher_editor_tutorials = Watch tutorial videos

Ark
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Re: SDK?

Postby Ark » Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:08 am

Hope they release one. The game as great potential for some good custom maps, later down the road.

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fb_joel
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Re: SDK?

Postby fb_joel » Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:24 am

The text stuff is actually copy of Shadowgrounds Survivor (but renamed), so don't read too much into that...

The problem with an SDK/level editor is that A) there might not be enough users to create a community (see what happened with Shadowgrounds games), B) the tools are not documented (again, the Shadowgrounds documentation we have is just abysmal), C) the tools are hard to use and it is difficult to create good-looking stuff.

It is not impossible, but I don't want to get your hopes too high... we'll probably make decisions when the game is out and things have calmed down, so to speak.
// Joel, Frozenbyte team

Ark
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Re: SDK?

Postby Ark » Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:25 am

Thank you for the consideration.

Ark
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Re: SDK?

Postby Ark » Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:22 pm

Just checked out the tools for shadowgrounds (didn't know it had tools). They seem very well done, clear interface, nothing looks too complex. I managed too figure a fair bit out before finding the wiki.

Is your current workflow still building the modular peice's in a 3d app (Which 3d app do you guys use btw?), then importing into a level editor?

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fb_joel
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Re: SDK?

Postby fb_joel » Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:34 pm

Yeah the objects are built in e.g. LightWave and then exported to a format that the editor supports.

The level editor itself isn't too hard to use (for placing objects etc), but it's the scripts and the "how do I make this run in the game" stuff that is a bit difficult and poorly documented. Shadowgrounds Survivor is the easiest to mod for, and it would be (or would have been) somewhat easy for modders to create levels almost on-par with the game's own levels. But with Trine it's a different story, it's more complex and the lighting requires a lot of expertise to get right.

But anyway, we'll see what happens. If we would release the tools, I think we'd want to have it documented to some degree and really try to give it a bit of real support, and that's a rather big undertaking. I just don't want to give any promises, because at this point I view it somewhat unlikely.
// Joel, Frozenbyte team

SirDrago
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Re: SDK?

Postby SirDrago » Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:38 pm

I think if making an SDK is using too many rescources then dont do it. Its not really doing an good for a small company. I dont see Trine getting that popular where it would make sense to make an SDK. I think its useful for big titles but for small ones its a waste of rescources.

Ark
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Re: SDK?

Postby Ark » Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:29 pm

Well in my opinion, mods for game do actually bring in more players. Take half -life 2 for example, someone might not like the half - life 2 setting, but the ton of mods out there will make people buy the game just for them.
Just because shadowlands didn't get the mod attention, shoudn't let you be put off for modding Trine.

Anyways i respect your decisions eithier way and hope you don't feel that im nagging you guys.

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Mr. ShadowStealer
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Re: SDK?

Postby Mr. ShadowStealer » Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:32 pm

Yeah but HL2 was developed in the sense that it will be moddable right from the beginning and also it is a lot more powerful engine and valve already had plans for SDKs and whatnot programs because HL got modded and modders wanted to have even more powerful engine to mod.
Not all of you have äää's and ööö's :P

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fb_joel
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Re: SDK?

Postby fb_joel » Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:38 pm

Yeah. And I actually I forgot the biggest reason why modding for the SG games didn't take off, and it probably applies to Trine: they don't have online multiplayer. How many successful singleplayer-only games are there that have good mod support and good mods available? Max Payne might be one, can't think of any others. And Max Payne sold a gazillion of units... Having no online really hurts modding interest (and of course it hurts a lot of other things, we know).

Edit: Right, forgot about the RPGs. So I'll narrow it to "how many singleplayer-only non-RPG games are there that have good mod support and good mods?" ;) Not sure where I'd put Thief, but in any case all those games are megahits (and would have been without the mod support too, although I am sure the mod support did bring a lot sales too, and keeps the games alive longer than normally).
// Joel, Frozenbyte team

Ark
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Re: SDK?

Postby Ark » Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:49 pm

Half - life 2 tools arn't that good. There model compiling workflow is terriable, messing about with .txt files and Hammer(there level editor) is very basic and arhaic. Generating lightmaps and computing portals take's.
Yet people still mod half - life 2.
I think it's fair to say it's not the tools, but the community that you generate by showing interest in releasing tools and showing the modders that you encourage modding to your game.

Oblivion, Fallout 3, Morrowind, Stalker and Thief to name a few, all have great singleplayer modding communities.


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