Page 1 of 2

Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:10 pm
by mosh
Just let me know if I get it right - You can only load saved game from the beginning of the level?
If it's true, what's the use of the checkpoints?
Some people cannot play for the amount of time needed to complete a level in one run, this make this game totally useless for them. I really don't like this console mentality.

I hope this get fixed,
mosh.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:47 pm
by SirDrago
You dont have 30 minutes to play a game? Then go and play Tetris.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:55 pm
by kolorabi
I think Mosh has a fair point. I guess it depends a bit on replayability and level design. Sometimes there are extra difficult points in a level, which take longer to pass. Let's say I struggle for a long time with a certain point, and when I finally complete it I get stuck later on in the same level and have to give up for the day. I can easily imagine becoming a bit frustrated if I then have to replay the first difficult spot next time I play the game.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 1:47 pm
by SirDrago
Yeah if you are a young gamer maybe. I remember games on the C-64 where there was no save option at all. That means when you shut of the game you have to start from Level 1 all over again. So for me its not a problem. Saving all the times kills the fun anyway a little bit since theres nothing to lose then.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 2:18 pm
by mosh
Drago,

I played the C-64, Apple IIe and Sinclair spectrum, please do not lecture me about games from old times. But since these days, some of us got a job, family and other duties, some of us might want to play for a shorter while. If "real" games like HL and BioShock can have the ability to save whenever one likes and still be good (Great!) games, I'm sure this can be implemented without reducing playability. If the developers thinks it makes the game too easy, I'm sure that a compromise, like the ability to reload from checkpoints is a good solution.

mosh.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 2:28 pm
by SirDrago
mosh wrote:Drago,

I played the C-64, Apple IIe and Sinclair spectrum, please do not lecture me about games from old times. But since these days, some of us got a job, family and other duties, some of us might want to play for a shorter while. If "real" games like HL and BioShock can have the ability to save whenever one likes and still be good (Great!) games, I'm sure this can be implemented without reducing playability. If the developers thinks it makes the game too easy, I'm sure that a compromise, like the ability to reload from checkpoints is a good solution.

mosh.


No its shit. Seriously dont tell me this shit that you dont have 30 minutes a day. No one is busy for 16 hours and if he is then something is his life goes wrong. Or just play on the weekend only. Or call in sick and play the game. Or press pause and leave the PC running and return at a later point. There are many ways to do it.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 2:43 pm
by mosh
Thanks. I longed for someone to help me with the mess my life is. Thank you for all your helpful advice! I admire people who knows the right way to live. What would I do without you. Yes, I know, my life is just a pile of shit.

Thanks again.

Com'n "sir"drago, Do you really have the truth up your ass?
Now can I have a serious reply from a developer?

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 5:21 pm
by SirDrago
mosh wrote:Thanks. I longed for someone to help me with the mess my life is. Thank you for all your helpful advice! I admire people who knows the right way to live. What would I do without you. Yes, I know, my life is just a pile of shit.

Thanks again.

Com'n "sir"drago, Do you really have the truth up your ass?
Now can I have a serious reply from a developer?


Acutally yes i do know the truth. If your life is so messy why you even playing and posting here? Dont you have more important things to do? I mean after all you wasting time posting here.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:16 pm
by Syrijon
Come on now, this isn't the kindergarten, there is no need for such uselessly agressive arguments :)
Obviously mosh does have a problem with the lack of a more liberating save system, and I'm sure no argumenting against it will make this problem vanish. There isn't even need for discussion, as this is just a subjective matter. Most players probably won't have a problem with the save system, but others obviously will, so I'd also be interested to hear what a developer has to say about it.

Still, I rather doubt that there can be a different save system, as that would require a lot more things to be saved. Right now, I think all that is saved is which levels you've unlocked, what your characters' stats are, and how many potions and treasures you've found in each level. If you play restart a level you've already beaten, it will be the same as the first time you've played it, apart from that the experience potions and treasures you've already found will be missing and unlocked already. I guess it would be too complicated to implement the possibility of loading and starting in the middle of a level, as that would require more information to be saved, like which enemies were already killed, which objects were broken, the position of other objects, etc.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:22 pm
by SirDrago
Syrijon wrote:Come on now, this isn't the kindergarten, there is no need for such uselessly agressive arguments :)


No its the internet....

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 7:02 pm
by mosh
SirDrago wrote:
Syrijon wrote:Come on now, this isn't the kindergarten, there is no need for such uselessly agressive arguments :)


No its the internet....


I rest my case.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2009 8:22 pm
by kolorabi
SirDrago wrote:Yeah if you are a young gamer maybe. I remember games on the C-64 where there was no save option at all. That means when you shut of the game you have to start from Level 1 all over again. So for me its not a problem. Saving all the times kills the fun anyway a little bit since theres nothing to lose then.

First of all, the first system I used for gaming had half the power of a C64, so yeah, I've been there. But I was young then, and I accepted that kind of bs because I had plenty of time for gaming. I'm not anymore, I have a life. And this life doesn't always fit with a gamer's schedule. And also, these days I play games to complete them, on the C64 I owned hundreds of games and only completed a handful of them.

But anyway. If a game offers the possibility to restart from checkpoints in the first place, then there's no good reason why it shouldn't let you save at these checkpoints when quitting.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 2:22 am
by fb_joel
Calm down guys. :)

At the moment a level can only be loaded from the beginning. We had planned a proper saving system with the checkpoints but it got a bit too complicated in many ways, and we decided to save a couple of weeks of development time and cut it. That's the truth.

Trine relies a bit more on the mental side of things, so once you figure out a solution to something, it's easier to repeat (so if you need to quit while playing a level, you'll get back to the same spot faster than you did on the first time, and you could try alternative tactics to keep the experience fresh). But yeah, if this becomes a huge problem then we'll have to see if some kind of a patch would be possible.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 12:15 am
by CodeApe
fb_joel wrote:Calm down guys. :)

At the moment a level can only be loaded from the beginning. We had planned a proper saving system with the checkpoints but it got a bit too complicated in many ways, and we decided to save a couple of weeks of development time and cut it. That's the truth.

Trine relies a bit more on the mental side of things, so once you figure out a solution to something, it's easier to repeat (so if you need to quit while playing a level, you'll get back to the same spot faster than you did on the first time, and you could try alternative tactics to keep the experience fresh). But yeah, if this becomes a huge problem then we'll have to see if some kind of a patch would be possible.


I hope you'll do it. So far this was the only (if huge) turnoff in the game.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:03 am
by Elandril
I have to fully agree with mosh, kolorabi and CodeApe! I'm sorry, if SirDragon cannot unserstand that there are people out there, who only have limited amounts of "free" time, due to work and family.

This is also for me the only huge sore point I found in the game so far. I hope the Devs will work something out, so that we can at least return to the latest checkpoint.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:18 pm
by Lamerstein
Last night I installed the game, played trough tutorial and then played hour and a half trough first level, without finishing it. Then I stopped playing because of real life interference, and now you tell me I have to play the WHOLE level, from the BEGINNING ???
How lame is that. Every console or PC game that I have played, which use checkpoint system save your progress at the last checkpoint you visit. The excuse for this is also very ... unprofessional - "It's too complicated, we don't have time". If every game can pull proper checkpoint save system, and you can't, may be you need to try harder.

Moreover, reading these forums today I learned that the last level is a stupid timed pixel perfect jumping over rising lava ??? This is what keeps me from playing platformers/ jump-n-run games since 8 bit consoles. Trine was the first game to try since 15 years , sold by its beauty and physics gameplay and it slaps me in the face with no saves and rising lava ???

Putting the game on shelf till patched.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:07 pm
by Undeadsee
I can only imagine how long it might take to save a game mid-level considering the physics system used. Every single object that can be moved needs its position saved, its angle saved, all forces that are being applied to it ect. I'd also imagine many bugs would pop up loading a saved game which would have to be address.
So I can see why there might not be a save in between levels. It dosn't affect me (gives me something to work towards before i give up) but I do understand how more casual-gaming lives might hurt by it.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 7:49 pm
by Lyshkhan
Pause, alt-tab, & come back later?
That's what I've always done...

Re: Saved game

Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:38 pm
by Ike
I fully agree with Lamerstein!

I played the demo and thought the game wouldn't save because it's a demo. Bought it, almost finished the first level and then was interrupted by my real life duties - yes I have a real life too! As I found myself right at the beginning AGAIN, I was sure it had to be a bug until I found this thread. I can't believe it's meant that way. I sureley wont play it again, until a fix is out for that. I wish, I would have tried a pirated copy first! :x

Re: Saved game

Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 5:34 am
by Helmutcheese
SirDrago wrote:
mosh wrote:Drago,

I played the C-64, Apple IIe and Sinclair spectrum, please do not lecture me about games from old times. But since these days, some of us got a job, family and other duties, some of us might want to play for a shorter while. If "real" games like HL and BioShock can have the ability to save whenever one likes and still be good (Great!) games, I'm sure this can be implemented without reducing playability. If the developers thinks it makes the game too easy, I'm sure that a compromise, like the ability to reload from checkpoints is a good solution.

mosh.


No its shit. Seriously dont tell me this shit that you dont have 30 minutes a day. No one is busy for 16 hours and if he is then something is his life goes wrong. Or just play on the weekend only. Or call in sick and play the game. Or press pause and leave the PC running and return at a later point. There are many ways to do it.


They may have a handicap child or a family member with cancer to care for.

Advise you engage your brain before opening mouth mate. 8)

Re: Saved game

Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:39 am
by Vestin
Helmutcheese wrote:They may have a handicap child or a family member with cancer to care for.

Advise you engage your brain before opening mouth mate. 8)

Wow... Those are some badass get-out-of-jail-for-free-cards, discussion-wise ;)... What next ? We'll find out that we can't offend these people, because they are gay ?

On topic - I'd have to side with SirDrago on this one. If you don't have enough time to pass levels which take less than THREE MINUTES (on our lovely speedruns) - you don't have a problem with your game. You have a problem with your life.
If you don't think speedruns are fun and want to take your time and explore (which, BTW, is awesome for this game) - you DO have some spare time. As such - if you want to quit, you can later run/swing through the part of the level you already explored and take your time when you reach the new part.
What's the POINT of starting the game if you even don't have enough time to relax, take your time and enjoy it ? It's like rushed replace - it might feel OK, but it's crude and something is definitely missing.
If I have a lot to do - I do it BEFORE I even start the game. I don't want to worry - I want to relax. Sure - I may not play as often, but when I do - it's a little holiday.

So - don't whine. Simply find some time if you wish to play (common sense isn't so common anymore, right ?). If you REALLY have other stuff to do - blame yourself. There are many ways to live a life - it's your goddamn choice. If you wish to have a family/wife/dog/3 jobs - go ahead. Just don't act like the world owes you anything. I consider the way saving is done in Trine a feature, not a bug. It's still damn easy to beat the game.
Seriously - you can respawn at the last checkpoint ad nauseam. That's not even remotely hard. Compare that to, I don't know, Bloodrayne. There you have saves between levels only, levels are a LOT bigger, no checkpoints and if you die - you have to start the level from the beginning. THAT was fun and challenging. It kept the tension high.
Also - I don't recall any checkpoint in the Lost Vikings (an obvious inspiration). Was the game fun ? As hell (It also had some instant-death obstacles, which made sense. For example - the spikes... When I fall on spikes in Trine, I get hurt once and then I can casually stride through them like nothing happened... That's a bit messed up). And the levels took quite some time to get through.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:00 pm
by Helmutcheese
Slag Faggots all you like, don't bother me.

Still your opinion although your entitled to it is a lot of TOSH.

Trine is buggy and can crash any PC, so to have to do 1 level again is bad IMO and I do not do speedruns.

Respect others opinions as well as your own.

Some of us ain't kiddies and have other things to do also.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:15 pm
by Vestin
Helmutcheese wrote:Still your opinion although your entitled to it is a lot of TOSH.

Not really, no.
Helmutcheese wrote:Trine is buggy and can crash any PC, so to have to do 1 level again is bad IMO and I do not do speedruns.

I have yet to see a single time it would crash. If it does crash for you - how and when ? With the patch or without ?
Also - if it were buggy, I'd suggest fixing that, not adding additional savepoints...
Helmutcheese wrote:Some of us ain't kiddies and have other things to do also.

That's what I was trying to argue against in my previous post. Read the damn thing. Then point out what exactly I'm wrong about. Cite the parts that you think don't make sense. On the other hand - provide an elaborate explanation of why you think otherwise.
You CAN'T simply render my entire post wrong with a single sentence. Your reply boils down to "No, you're wrong, screw you". Either don't bother writing anything or prove your point.

Re: Saved game

Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:23 pm
by FB_Lauri
We know this is a small issue, but again, we had to pick between great game or just a game with all the features it could have :)

I highly doubt Trine crashes a lot, as we would heard about that :)

Re: Saved game

Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:36 pm
by Helmutcheese
Vestin wrote:
Helmutcheese wrote:Still your opinion although your entitled to it is a lot of TOSH.

Not really, no.
Helmutcheese wrote:Trine is buggy and can crash any PC, so to have to do 1 level again is bad IMO and I do not do speedruns.

I have yet to see a single time it would crash. If it does crash for you - how and when ? With the patch or without ?
Also - if it were buggy, I'd suggest fixing that, not adding additional savepoints...
Helmutcheese wrote:Some of us ain't kiddies and have other things to do also.

That's what I was trying to argue against in my previous post. Read the damn thing. Then point out what exactly I'm wrong about. Cite the parts that you think don't make sense. On the other hand - provide an elaborate explanation of why you think otherwise.
You CAN'T simply render my entire post wrong with a single sentence. Your reply boils down to "No, you're wrong, screw you". Either don't bother writing anything or prove your point.



Your a LAMER TBH.

You do not make any sense period and try to sound clever but your a n00b who cannot accept other peoples opinions and expect them to accept yours.

You will not go through life smoothly with that attitude.

Having Saves as many asked for would not make any difference to users who don't want/need them.